"I am a diva, yes, I have always been one." Ritu Dalmia, an excellence in Indian cuisine with 15 restaurants managed between Italy and India, has a way of presenting herself that is irreverent and provocative. A tangible sign of a brilliant mind and an innate charisma that have always made her, in my eyes, a destined one. In this interview, painstakingly drawn from her countless commitments and her whirlwind pace of life, she talks to us about "cooking" not only from a "technical" perspective but also guides us through a philosophical and spiritual journey, very Indian, that allows us to grasp those subtle and apparently mysterious threads that connect Italy and India.
Spices and their use. What is the line of distinction between enriching a dish and transforming it?
It is not easy.
Mix the spices the right way
It's complicated even for us. You know, I always say that with Indian food I learn something new every day. It all seems very simple, but it's not; there's a fundamental complexity that revolves around the spices, in their essential component, far from the myth. What makes one think that spices "are" Indian cuisine. If your mouth "is on fire," it's Indian food. I think that's, once again, wrong because the use of spices must be very "delicate" and not overwhelm the ingredients; it took me a long time to internalize this simple yet challenging lesson.
The rejection of the stereotype, I would say.
Exactly. You have to think that spices are also the foundation of Western cuisine. Sugar is a spice. Garlic is a spice. The use of spices needs to be calibrated with the technique in both the East and the West.
Take cumin, for example. If you fry it, if you roast it, then it releases the correct aromas. But you need to use the right amount. Usually, it is said that “less is more”, and this is a correct definition especially with spices. You need to know what the right quantity is and how it integrates into the dish. Cumin has a very sweet flavor but at the moment you cook it, the dish takes on a very flavored taste.
Cardamom adds aroma but you can’t add 500 pieces. At most one or two. Spices, in short, should be “released” in the dish, allowing you, when you close your eyes and taste it, to sense that something different and indefinable.
Another very important thing, especially for your cooking style, is the term fusion.
Oh no! Oh no! Absolutely not! Fusion is confusion. I do not violate recipes. What I do is at most mix regional foods. To understand, pair a curry from Kerala (a southern state of the Indian subcontinent) accompanied by bread from northern India. I am not changing the recipe of the dish from Kerala nor am I changing the dish from the north; I am simply combining the regions together. So yes, it is something I like to play with, but I wouldn't call it fusion. A dish of Roman gnocchi, for example, can be eaten with parmesan, with gorgonzola, or accompanied by caponata, for instance. So you are pairing a Roman flavor with a Sicilian one. I am not altering the regional specificity of the dish; I am just combining the flavors together.
My kitchen is not fusion.
She wants to be brave and fun.
From your point of view, is cooking more about application or talent?
No, it is a combination of both. Just 3 hours ago, I had a phone call with a famous chef from the United Kingdom. We need to do a collaborative dinner in June. While we were discussing, the organizer suggested sending his recipes to me to prepare, and I would do the same for him. Well, we started laughing. Because if you give a recipe to five people, the same recipe, the same ingredients, you'll get five different results. So it’s not just technique, it’s not just application; there has to be talent behind it all, but on its own, that's not enough.
When I say that these five dishes will be “different,” it does not mean worse than the original. Everyone will have a little touch of who made it, using the quantities in a different way, the cooking methods, the plating, and this will create five different worlds; this applies to food, just as it does to life;
Talent allows you to add your own touch.
not that of another.
I have a curiosity: how much time do you spend creating a new dish?
By now, the time I spend in the kitchen is dedicated to creating new dishes for the restaurant. So if I am really honest with you, I would say 15-20 days in a year, but no more than that. I think that my work today, more than cooking, is to become a mentor for the new generation of chefs, for the people who work with us. Don't forget that I've also gotten older and among all the restaurants we have, I can't be in every restaurant cooking every day.
I think the challenge is to maintain the same standard. And this is a mystery, because you have many chefs who obviously have "different" touches.
I can do it because I am a magician! It's very simple.
In reality, I do constant checks; I pursue quality and this makes my life complicated. What helps me is that 95% of my clients are regular customers. So, if I make a mistake, or if my teams make a mistake, even a small one, I find out within five minutes.
So there is a continuous audit, ensuring that the sales chain is the same everywhere. The ingredients must be the same everywhere, because if you have the best chefs but the ingredients are not right, it doesn't work. It's a very difficult part of our job, and it's also expensive.
Do you think that cooking is, like sports, perhaps one of the few meritocratic fields?
It is totally meritocratic. You feel that there is no other way to do it; in this, I see no affinity with sports, but with art.
It is really a matter of ability. It doesn't matter which family you come from, it's not a question of dynasty, and it's not even a matter of gender. Talent can exist in both a man and a woman. In men, the way of working, the timing of work, and the physicality of work are different. Today, there are many new restaurants in big cities, but also in small ones, that "revolve" around women. It's almost like an explosion, and the fact that this is happening in India too makes me really happy.
Ego, is it an enemy or an ally? Because I always remember your "feeling" diva.
Yes, I am Diva
When I was young, the ego was my best friend. As I grew older, this "diva" became much calmer and subtler, but I believe that at the beginning of my career, the ego gave me strength, it gave me appetite, it gave me ambition.
Then over time you realize that, in reality, the ego is no longer an ally, and by letting it go, life becomes easier. You don't feel like you have to compete, you don't feel like you have to be number one, you don't feel like, once you reach step 99, you have to get to 999. And when you are at 999, then you want 9999. So, I am proud of what I do. However, as I said, today I would say that humility is my best friend, not the ego.
So, in my life, I had the ego as my best friend and, slowly, humility has taken the lead.
Where do you see yourself in 5 years?
Oh, my God. I don’t even know what I will do tomorrow. I can’t even say where I will be in a month. How can I say where I will be in 5 years? And in a way, your question is a contradiction. Because if the ego were my best friend, I would have given a complete list of where I would be in 5 years and what I could achieve. But, since humility is, at the moment, my best friend, I can’t answer because anything I would say would be a lie.
Perhaps I want to be, as I am now, which is why I don’t know what will happen next month and then the month after; an agenda that changes every day. Can I be honest with you? In a way, it’s also nice not to know, not to think. Man proposes, God disposes. So taking each day as it comes, I believe is the most important lesson to follow.
